Ikonboard » Printable Version of Topic » Star wars Vs. Star Trek

Forum: The Classroom
Topic: Star wars Vs. Star Trek
started by: C_Puppy

Posted by C_Puppy on Oct. 24 2001,16:18

Before anyone says anything-- Yes, I know this is similar to comparing apples to oranges..... But I have to ask- Which is a better story?
I grew up watching star trek(old skool) and Dr. who since I was 4 years old, I didn't see star wars until I was 6. I liked star trek in its spinnoffs, but for me I have always felt that star wars really grabbed me- I just feel like although star trek was a tv series and there were three star wars movies--((( THERE IS NO PHANTOM MENACE!!!!)))-- DIE JAR JAR DIE!!)))
The reason why I feel the star wars(original) is better is because of the fact of its quailty of storytelling was linear- all star treks really had--(up until voyager) was an almost Sit-com-esk tendancy of returning to where the characters had started at the beging of the show(which weakened it in more ways than one I think), My brothers are both serious trekkies, and I have read their paraphanila-- I simply believe that star wars universe feels more sturdy, and better thought out for the most part. Now this is a point for discussion and I wanna see how other people pull in on this issue-
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"We're all monkeys......HEY! Get Outta my CHAIR!" - 12 Monkeys

This message has been edited by C_Puppy on October 25, 2001 at 11:20 AM

Posted by LiNeY on Oct. 24 2001,18:19

Star Wars.

For the simple reason that I never watched Star Trek. Please don't flame me... I'm a girl, and from Europe, and brought up in an old-fashioned way!!!

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C'est à cette amie que je me confie - mais c'est l'autre que j'embrasse...

Posted by EvilGenius on Oct. 24 2001,19:02

i'm a super-geek, and Star Wars' story is better than Star Trek's.. and i can quote all SW movies.. and 99\% of ST:TNG episodes.

*bow*

Posted by syf on Oct. 24 2001,19:25

Movies? Star Wars. Storyline? Star Trek. The episodes are much more interesting, funny to watch (old/original version) and thought provoking. How original is Star Wars? Not very. It's about a boy who becomes a knight, trained by an old wizard, and goes off to rescue a princess who's swept away by an evil wizard and all of his cronies. Good job on the originality, Lucas. That hasn't been written about countless times over the past thousand or so years.

Posted by DeadAnztac on Oct. 24 2001,20:03

Star Wars is better, swords, higher powers, more like anime. That's as far as the issue goes with me.

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~Anztac [ Pertinaciously disconsolate ]

Posted by Spydir on Oct. 24 2001,20:57

I thought they both sucked.

Well, SW was ok, but I could never see the point in getting all fanatical over it. I saw atleast 5 episodes of all the different star trek series, and I thought all of them sucked. It's usually the captain in star trek that pisses me off, too.

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Net Syndrome - < www.netsyndrome.net >
Catch The Sickness

Posted by askheaves on Oct. 25 2001,00:04

I'd vote for Star Trek just for the fact that it's an interesting study of what the human race can become. Star Wars just happened too long ago, and the galaxy it occured in was just too far away.

Posted by CatKnight on Oct. 25 2001,00:24

my thoughts exactly. star trek takes place in our future. star wars is more fantasy-like and to me, less realistic. You never hear anyone talking about engineering or physics, etc in star wars. everything just is. and when they introduced metaclorites that just fucked everything up (sort of like with Blade). you can't make a mysterious force, have people use their imaginations with it, then explain it and be like "your imagination was wrong!".

Posted by EvilGenius on Oct. 25 2001,02:10

i liked SW for jsut that.. it was all just a story to get caught up in.. it's what makes me a huge movie fan, and wind up suffering 3 years in slave labor running them.. anyway, ST has some deep meaning behind it.. granted it's a good one, and i think they do well with it, and i like ST... but i'd watch the SW movies anytime over ST episodes.. save maybe the first ST movie.. i liked V-GER..

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Don't hold strong opinions about things you don't understand.

Posted by Observer on Oct. 26 2001,05:54

If I were to compare just the movies and tv episodes, no books, I would say I prefer SW. Why? Fewer hole and incongruities. For each new ST series, things don't match up. Even within the same series. If anyone can find the Star Wars equivalent to < this link >, I'd be happy to read it.

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When 1337 hax0rs start impaling each other with swords and typing code with a hook on one hand, then they can modify the term "pirate."

Posted by C_Puppy on Oct. 26 2001,13:51

Exactly, I mean when the star wars books started out-- they needed to be approved by George lucas himself-- now it is a bit more delegated-- but the people at Lucasflim really go the extra mile to keep things together(until george got a few things a little skewed in the Phantom meance)-- Startrek does have more episodes but I don't see why it has to be too much different than the starwars model of getting rid of incongruities--

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"We're all monkeys......HEY! Get Outta my CHAIR!" - 12 Monkeys

Posted by Beldurin on Oct. 26 2001,14:33

It's a really different comparison. Basicall, SW is a classic Joseph Campbell "Hero's Journey" type of story. In my opinion, however, it's simply the story of King Arthur retold in a different setting (but with lasers!).

ST (original series) was all about tackling social issues in a time where a lot of things were taboo, and the show did it in a way that most of the people didn't even know that they were being "educated." This was a two-edged sword...it was subtle and so avoided a lot of reactionary retribution, but on the other hand they missed some of the people because the issues, metephors, and parallels went over their heads. TNG worked along similar lines, but there aren't the same kinds of issues to address. DS9 and Voyager were about finding another ST to make money and pretty much just blew. And as far as the ST movies go, I gave up after "First Contact" and should've given up after "Generations," which was the last good one.

I'm just surprised that there hasn't been a gay character on a ST series yet (except for Riker).

All in all, SW has the edge in pure story and storytelling, ST has the edge in story variety, technical detail, and world development.

That's what I think, anyway

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Give me ambiguity or give me something else...

Posted by Dark Knight Bob on Oct. 26 2001,18:21

quote:
Originally posted by Beldurin:
I'm just surprised that there hasn't been a gay character on a ST series yet (except for Riker).

there was beverly crusher fell "in love" with a trill that ended up going into a woman.

they then kissed in the sick bay. yay lesbian star trek

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simultaneity is not absolute. So just because you think i'm wrong, from my frame of reference i'm right!

Posted by CatKnight on Oct. 26 2001,18:33

I always explained light sabers as being super-heated plasma contained by a cylindrical magnetic field

Posted by Rhydant on Oct. 26 2001,19:47

quote:
Originally posted by C_Puppy:
Before anyone says anything-- Yes, I know this is similar to comparing apples to oranges.....

no, < THIS > is comparing apples and oranges.

Posted by EvilGenius on Oct. 26 2001,20:16

well, anyone's opinion's on who was hotter..

Princess Leia
Deanna Troy
Doctor Crusher
Seven of Nine

Posted by Vigilante on Oct. 26 2001,20:22

Jadzia Dax (Terry Farrell, DS9)

Posted by C_Puppy on Oct. 26 2001,20:39

I always had a crush on crusher-- I mean I think she definatly has the experiance for a great time-- age can definatly help

Actually, my friend says councilor Cleavage All the way-- and happens to be hot in the sack

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"We're all monkeys......HEY! Get Outta my CHAIR!" - 12 Monkeys

This message has been edited by C_Puppy on October 30, 2001 at 07:35 AM

Posted by C_Puppy on Oct. 26 2001,20:43

quote:
Originally posted by Dark Knight Bob:
compare SW to wrath of khan and then see which you think has more intelligent humour and emotion.
"woo the death star lets blow it up"
compared to
"with my last breath i spit at thee, with all my hatred i stab at thee" "our sheilds are collapsing!" "raise them!" "I CANT!!!" "FIRE!!" BOOM GOES THE BRIGDE!"

I use to be a theater major--- I just cringe at every time they use shakespeare in star trek flims--- its like fingernails on a chalkboard

Posted by Dark Knight Bob on Oct. 26 2001,22:04

i wont mention star trek 6 then bitch anyway j00 suck for knowing shakespeare

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simultaneity is not absolute. So just because you think i'm wrong, from my frame of reference i'm right!

Posted by Dark Knight Bob on Oct. 27 2001,05:32

star trek captures the imagination more because it is based around the fact that it is possible theoretically that it might be a true point in human evolution. the fact that it could happen means its more exciting.

SW is basically a samurai film that georgey boy nicked and mixed in as many sterotypical charachters as possible. cant have swords in the furture so we have light sabres that magically emmit light that magically stops at a point in thin air. sure i love to watch star wars and enjoy it cos its just easy watching and fun but the point you wanted to prove was which had a better story.

compare SW to wrath of khan and then see which you think has more intelligent humour and emotion.
"woo the death star lets blow it up"
compared to
"with my last breath i spit at thee, with all my hatred i stab at thee" "our sheilds are collapsing!" "raise them!" "I CANT!!!" "FIRE!!" BOOM GOES THE BRIGDE!"

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simultaneity is not absolute. So just because you think i'm wrong, from my frame of reference i'm right!

Posted by C_Puppy on Oct. 27 2001,09:58

quote:
Originally posted by EvilGenius:
i can see Patrick Stewart reading children's books to his kids in a shakespearian voice.

patrick stewart is kinda the exception to the rule --- being the fact he is one of the most respected shakespearian actors on the planet

Posted by EvilGenius on Oct. 27 2001,17:13

i can see Patrick Stewart reading children's books to his kids in a shakespearian voice.

Posted by damien_s_lucifer on Oct. 27 2001,21:50

Back to the oranges and apples theme...

I like SW because it's visceral... Good vs. Evil, light sabers, huge space battles, Yoda's Zen-like wisdom...

I like ST because it's cerebral. Things are rarely Good vs. Evil in ST; things are often muddy and grey; battles move like chess games...

the REAL question, I think, is... if the Enterprise came upon the Death Star, who would win?

Posted by chmod on Oct. 28 2001,08:20

Sadly, I think the Death Star would win. The Enterprise doesn't have those secret plans that the rebels in SW did... that made all the difference. But the Enterprise crew is known for being able to improvise in a tough situation, so who knows.

Posted by Wolfguard on Oct. 28 2001,15:05

i say scrap both of them and stick with Babylon 5

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Fucknuggets flamed while you wait.< TeamWolfguard.com >
< Robot Conflict >

Posted by Ash on Oct. 28 2001,17:22

quote:
... if the Enterprise came upon the Death Star, who would win?

Which Death Star, and which version of the Enterprise are meeting for this epic dual?

Gut feelings (no tech specs) tell me that the Death Star would kick the ass of some of the earlier Enterprises (as long as they don't hit the exhaust port), but the Next Gen Enterprise could take it out.

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Yeah, ok, whatever. I don't speak "Crazy Bitch."

Posted by Dark Knight Bob on Oct. 28 2001,20:14

wolverine would kick their ass

seriously though the enterprise could bombard the fucking lug shit from warp speed i dont see them capapble of shooting it down even though we are comparing films that use completely different laws of physics in them.

woo the force would stop them... no i think the simple fact that you simply use the age old excuse of "reconfiguring" the deflector sheild to emmit some random burst of unknown particles that disables certain key parts of the giant moon sponge with a dent in the side

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simultaneity is not absolute. So just because you think i'm wrong, from my frame of reference i'm right!

Posted by sHuoReNviOLiN on Oct. 28 2001,23:08

quote:
Originally posted by Ash:
Which Death Star, and which version of the Enterprise are meeting for this epic dual?
Gut feelings (no tech specs) tell me that the Death Star would kick the ass of some of the earlier Enterprises (as long as they don't hit the exhaust port), but the Next Gen Enterprise could take it out.

Nah, the Death Star'd get them while Worf was still trying to open hailing frequencies...and plus, the Enterprise -never- fires first...they always gotta be hit first before they do anything.

Voyager might be able to take them out though...just cuz they have the Delta Flyer...that's gotta be the equal of several X-wings at least...Enterprise's shuttles suck...Oh, and plus they have the random Borg tech that Seven pulls outta her...somewhere...

Now, the REALLY real question is, what about Death Star vs Borg Cube?

This message has been edited by sHuoReNviOLiN on October 29, 2001 at 06:14 PM

Posted by veistran on Oct. 29 2001,01:18

The other thing is, the Death Star has what 144 TIEs? If it launched them all, even if the Enterprise killed it, I think the TIEs could probably kill the Enterprise.

Posted by Dark Knight Bob on Oct. 29 2001,09:12

quote:
Originally posted by sHuoReNviOLiN:
Nah, the Death Star'd get them while Worf was still trying to open hailing frequencies...and plus, the Enterprise -never- fires first...

why would the enterprise go towards the death star in the first place? to blow the fuck out of it so i doubt they'd try hailing it first.

quote:
The other thing is, the Death Star has what 144 TIEs? If it launched them all, even if the Enterprise killed it, I think the TIEs could probably kill the Enterprise.

ties have a limited range and speed again the enterprise could just fly past at warp speed and nuke the bastard

quote:
but then lucas would invent a race of small cute furry things to crawl out of the air vent and throw rocks at picard

NOOO NOT MORE TRIBBLES!!!

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simultaneity is not absolute. So just because you think i'm wrong, from my frame of reference i'm right!

This message has been edited by Dark Knight Bob on October 30, 2001 at 04:14 AM

Posted by C_Puppy on Oct. 29 2001,09:32

Okay, Now I am not a trekie by any means-- but doesn't the enterprise and other federation vessels have to come out of warp to do any sort of fighting? and I think the deathstar would have access to a "slightly" larger powersupply for its shields? Seeing as it is the size of a moon. I don't care how powerful Dilithum is-- ain't that funky. Also can't it warp too? I agree about the tie fighters-- but they would be a get distraction. Anyway-as previously mentioned wolverine would definatly kick all asses conserined

But the 1.44 TIE's effectiveness would depend if it is a fat 32 or fat 16 partition
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"We're all monkeys......HEY! Get Outta my CHAIR!" - 12 Monkeys

This message has been edited by C_Puppy on October 30, 2001 at 04:36 AM

Posted by C_Puppy on Oct. 29 2001,09:34

Edit--- Sorry about spelling-- I am illigitamet-- I never learned to spell, hooked on phoniks just didn't work for me-- but hooked on crack sure did! Its the quicker picker-upper

Posted by DuSTman on Oct. 29 2001,17:51

I reckon it'd go the enterprise' way at first, but then lucas would invent a race of small cute furry things to crawl out of the air vent and throw rocks at picard. Doesn't stand a hope in hell after that.

Posted by ASCIIMan on Oct. 29 2001,19:32

Apparently the gravitational binding energy of Yavin is ~10,000 times that of Alderan. Interesting...

/me off to build a Death Star capable of destroying Yavin quicker than those puny ones in SW.

Posted by sHuoReNviOLiN on Oct. 29 2001,20:44

quote:
Originally posted by Dark Knight Bob:
why would the enterprise go towards the death star in the first place? to blow the fuck out of it so i doubt they'd try hailing it first.

They'd hafta make first contact...Starfleet can't interfere w/ other civilizations' affairs (yeah Prime Directive)...so any action taken has to be self-defense...and with Picard being anal about the rules and regs, he'd get them blown up first.

My God, what's wrong with me, I'm starting to take this seriously...

This message has been edited by sHuoReNviOLiN on October 30, 2001 at 03:46 PM

Posted by Dark Knight Bob on Oct. 29 2001,21:04

first contact?!?!!? are you mad! theres a fucking great MOON with a pulse cannon capable of blowing up a planet!

and yes they are capable of fighting in warp they do it all the time its just they dont bother firing on non moving objects cos they cant be assed to write it into the script.

christ sakes man they've done a transport at warp (voyager series 2 i think) i am a "trekkie" in that i keep track of the science but thats it and thats what counts in this argument.

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simultaneity is not absolute. So just because you think i'm wrong, from my frame of reference i'm right!

Posted by Vigilante on Oct. 29 2001,21:23

Torpedos can be fired while at warp speeds. Recall the Enterprise firing aftward at the Q-sphere in the first TNG episode.

Posted by veistran on Oct. 29 2001,22:50

Hehe... I was off by more than a bit on my TIE fighters guess hehe, < http://www.theforce.net/swtc/ds.html#hangar > ... yeah I think the Death Star wins.

Posted by C_Puppy on Oct. 29 2001,23:00

that doesn't make any sence unless the torpedo itself has a warp drive or stays within the sphere of influence the ship's warp drive has on the surrounding space--- that is of course saying that as technical as star trek geeks like to pretend the ST-TNG univerise is-- that they found some way around common logic

Posted by damien_s_lucifer on Oct. 29 2001,23:16

Either version of the Death Star would have vaporized the Enterprise in microseconds. Think of what happened to the Rebel transports in Return of the Jedi...

Tie fighters would've been sent out to distract the Enterprise while the planet-destoying cannon was warmed up.

The Enterprise would take out all the TIE fighters with its phasers. Picard, feeling cocky, would hail the Death Star. The Death Star would answer with its primary weapon, and the Enterprise would go the way of Alderaan.

You don't know the power of the Dark Side...

Posted by mqa on Oct. 29 2001,23:38

I think the Enterprise would win. All it has to do is maintain an orbit around the death star that keeps it out of the main cannons line of fire.

Posted by DeadAnztac on Oct. 30 2001,02:07

All the Empire would have to do is tell Picard "Hey, your beating us, we surender, can we send someone to negotiate peace?" Picard, being the stupid sentimental type would allow it, and *BAM* two dark knights take over the enterprise. That or Palpitine (sp?) would just enter their puny brains and making them blow up their reactor core (We've never seen THAT happen to an enterprise ship, have we?).

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~Anztac [ Pertinaciously disconsolate ]

Posted by chmod on Oct. 30 2001,05:39

I'm not a trekkie either, so bear with me.
I don't think the TIES would present such a great problem to the Enterprise. First of all, the TIES have no shields or defenses, so a tiny little zap from a phaser would easily dispatch them. The Enterprise pretty much has flawless aim with the Phasers (as far as I remember) and can shoot at more than one object at a time. If the phasers don't take care of it fast enough, then the TIES would fire their little lasers at the Enterprise, and that would do pretty much nothing (because of the shields).

edit: 200 posts, w00tah

This message has been edited by chmod on October 30, 2001 at 12:41 PM

Posted by Vigilante on Oct. 30 2001,05:45

< http://www.theforce.net/swtc/ >

Posted by Dark Knight Bob on Nov. 01 2001,12:18

that was pretty stupid though of the rebel fleet to put themselves in front of the fucking cannon!

and the torpedos are designed to be fired at warp the phasers are what are used at sub warp speeds.

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Oh and by the way, if you see your mum this weekend, be sure to tell her SATAN!!! - Orbital